sensable outdoor solar lighting options?

[jclaudii]

Hello all, I'm a new member here, but I've been reading the boards for years.  I have finally acquired my own home and am able to finally make changes that will stick.

Here is what I want to do, I want to be able to have a flood light that is solar powered to be able to see when we get out of our vehicles at night.  Now I have seen a few nice units at Harbor Freight that look decent, but the price isn't at 43+ bucks.  Plus it's funner to do it your self.  

What I'm looking for is a way to mount a light about 10 feet in the air in a "flood" light pattern with a small solar cell powering some AA's or even a 6 volt cell recharging a 6v lead acid battery.   I'm guessing led's are the approach as far as effenciy, but I'm not sure about light output.  I could use a 6v halogen as long as it goes off after motion is no longer sensed.  I'm also unsure on how to wire up a motion circuit.  

I'm just looking for some ideas before I go buying parts or buy a premade unit from HF.  Thanks in advance.  

[wooferhound]

LEDs are less efficient than a Compact Fluorescent bulb.

Home Depot has a Solar Motion Detector Fluorescent outdoor light too

[DamonHD]

W, I don't think that's true for the newest LEDs, especially cool white.  I have a nice 9W (warm white) on my desk that does nearly 60lm/W, as good as the CFL it replaces.

Rgds

Damon

[tecker]

 X10 has a fairly good 12 volt motion  The lighting is a crap shoot but improving all the time .Use a larger panel than you need . A motor cycle  battery is a pretty good unit for small installations . So you hava a panel in the 25 watt range a 8 x 8 pvc box for the battery and a light fixture on a 4x4 box and a dump controller with a wireless camera as as a dumper . Total cost $150 or so DIY.  

[tecker]

With some other dumper . The camera will run it up to $225

[Ungrounded Lightning Rod]

We were due for the "crossover" about now.  It's nice to see the first LED assemblies coming out that are on a par with CFLs.  Expect more of them, then some that beat CFLs first by a bit, then by a bunch, in the next couple years, followed by a price drop.

I'm particularly glad to see them making it to market now, while the eco-wackos are working on legislation to mandate fixtures that can ONLY hold the mercury-laden fluorescent devices in all new home construction and renovation.  (The recent hype about the miniscule bits of toxic materials in the LEDs tells me the fluorescent manufacturers are also expecting LEDs to become a threat in the near future.)

[ghurd]

Be nice if the DC CFLs follow the price drop.

A $3 120VAC CFL sure beats a $18 12VDC CFL on quality, at this time.

Be nice if a $3 12VDC CFL would match quality with the current $1 120VAC CFLs.

Then the LEDs could follow the same $/W/Lumen path?  LOL

G-

[Ungrounded Lightning Rod]

Economy of scale.  120V CFLs sell to the consumer house lighting market.  12V sells to the (much smaller) off-grid, RV, and yachting markets.  (Seagoing stuff is pricey because it has to stand a moist and salty environment and meet tougher standards.  Also because much of its target market has (or is perceived to have) deep pockets.)

Saw some interesting stuff at a chandlery last couple weekends:

 - 12V CFL fixtures with the tiny straw-sized tubes, like those used in LCD displays:  Straight, snaked, or embedded in transparent mini-fluorescent tubes of standard form factor.

 - LED arrays and fixtures for area lighting, spot lighting (some with white/red selectability for keeping night adaptation while at the navigation station), as navigation signaling and marker lights, etc.

(Appropriate, since chandleries started out as suppliers of marine lighting consumables - candles and lamp oil - before they evolved into convenience/general stores for sailboats and small powerboats.)

I've seen LED marker lights for trucks and trailers for some time now.  I bet a good truck stop, RV store, or auto-customization supply will have similar 12V living-space lighting fixtures by now.

[wooferhound]

I saw 12 volt 8 watt lights at Walmart for $7

They run on batteries or a 12 volt supply through a socket on the fixture

The same lights sell for $11 at Home Depot or Lowes

[JamesJackson]

I've finally gotten all of the bits collected, so this is what I'm going to do.

I have 4 Amber LEDs (I don't want to use white - bugs collect around white lights).

I already have the solar panel (21-Watts) and the battery (17-Ah) - which is charged using a Morningstar Sunguard-4 charge controller.

I have my LVD (Low-Voltage Disconnect) boards - that also have an InfraRed (IR) switch built in.

Sooooooo... hooking it all together, I get an Amber porch light that puts out enough light to see the front porch at night - and doesn't attract bugs (I've already tested this bit).

When I drive up - I grab a handy IR remote controller - aim it at the IR sensor, and ZAP!! on go the lights! (using a handy IR pistol - as used in laser tag - I can get over 40 feet of distance)

Or - if I leave them on when I leave - and the battery depletes to the LVD drop-out level (it'd take many hours to do this... probably 8 or more), then the LVD controller will disconnect the battery - which of course turns off the light.

Anyway... there are many ways to achieve what you want to do. I say - try something - if you don't like it - re-examine the problem, and try a different approach.

Regards,

James Jackson

Oztronics

[scottsAI]

Ghurd,

Small inverters work great with CFL.

Tested out a 100w inverter powering an 18 watt CFL(verified on Killowatt meter) took just under 20w.

Very happy with performance.

Most of the 12v CFL are small wattage, I wanted 18 or 23 watt, not to be found.

The 100w inverter cost $10 on eBay including shipping. Over all cheaper than 12v CFL.

Nice feature can power couple more CFL with same inverter, love options!

What do you think?

Have fun,

Scott.

[ghurd]

My luck with the little "no wires" 50~100W inverters has been horrible.

I used to say CFLs and inverters don't get along with each other.

I recently changed my mind, at least a little.  Some at the shop are going fine after a year or 2 now with 0 problems with the inverters or the CFLs.  Not used much. Name brand inverters and CFLs.

Could be inverters and CFLs are getting better, or just a long string of bad luck before.

There are 12V 25W class CFLs.  Quality of the ones I saw was poor for the price.

G-

[scottsAI]

Tested several inverters: 70, 100, 350, 1000w trip lite.

Found a pock inverter 100w by Xantrex, running two 18 w CFL gets warm after an hour. Runs my laptop just fine also.

Bought two 70w inverters for $13, driving one 18 w CFL shutdown too hot after 45 minutes. Worked after cooled down. Power draw was the same, opened it up, limited Heat sink area, to use would repackage adding heat sink area.

Interesting my Vector 350w used exactly the same power as the 100w, surprising. Expected the 100w to be less. 350W has fan, can drive many CFL at once.

1000w stand by current was 6x higher... forget the numbers.

Have fun,

Scott.

[jclaudii]

Thanks everyone for the quick comments!

I didn't mean for this to get into a debate on cfl's or led's, but o-well when the technology is advancing at a decent pace.  I may have to "tinker" with some lighting solutions.  I know the x10 stuff has some things I can perhaps "adapt" to my design similar to the ir control.  I'm still thinking motion control would be the easiest way to control light on or off.  This would be coupled with an eye of course so it won't turn on during the day.  Not sure about the dump load yet.  I guess my first step is to obtain a solar panel of some sort.  I'll ask my dad back at the farm if he has any older fence chargers that "don't work" anymore that I could have.  I've got a few ups and alarm batteries that hold a decent charge that I use for hobbies and such.  I'll keep my options open about using 12v flourscent, but for the moment I'm thinking LED's are more scalable in light output vs run time.  

Thanks again everyone.  

[ghurd]

Just a thought...

Lowe's has (had?) a 4 AA motion light with a daylight sensor. $13? Amer-Tack, but sometimes they are packaged with another name.

Replace the 4 AAs with an LM7806.

Replace the bulb with a mini relay or mosfet (the bulb is wired backwards, the tip is negative).

Use the relay or mosfet to trigger the other 12V lighting.

Make sure it has the daylight sensor.  The types without the daylight sensor waste a lot of power 24/7.

It looks like a tiny round solar panel on the top, maybe 3/8" dia.

Sometimes Lowe's has them that already have LEDs.  Would simply need to have a 6V system, or use the LM7806 to power it from a 12V battery.

G-